TOP TEN MARVEL RIP-OFFS
10. Hawkeye (Green Arrow)
9. Fantastic Four (Challengers of the Unknown)
8. X-Men (Doom Patrol)
7. Dr. Strange (Dr. Fate)
6. Captain America (The Shield)
5. Avengers (JLA)
4. Mr. Fantastic (Elongated Man, et al.)
3. Man-Thing (The Heap)
2. Squadron Supreme(JLA)
And the Number One Marvel Comics Rip-Off is...
1. Captain Marvel (Captain Marvel)
Marvel comics will suck for all time because of this one. Shame, shame, Marvel.
OK, I’m aware that the X-Men one isn’t fair, so allow me to replace it with Ka-Zar. Do I even have to mention who he rips off? Ka-Zar by the way, was a rip off in the pulps before Marvel was called Marvel and before they published comics.
9. Fantastic Four (Challengers of the Unknown)
8. X-Men (Doom Patrol)
7. Dr. Strange (Dr. Fate)
6. Captain America (The Shield)
5. Avengers (JLA)
4. Mr. Fantastic (Elongated Man, et al.)
3. Man-Thing (The Heap)
2. Squadron Supreme(JLA)
And the Number One Marvel Comics Rip-Off is...
1. Captain Marvel (Captain Marvel)
Marvel comics will suck for all time because of this one. Shame, shame, Marvel.
OK, I’m aware that the X-Men one isn’t fair, so allow me to replace it with Ka-Zar. Do I even have to mention who he rips off? Ka-Zar by the way, was a rip off in the pulps before Marvel was called Marvel and before they published comics.
posted by Dominic at 6:33 PM
23 Comments:
What a sad existence you must have.
Sitting around your boxes and boxes of DC comics knowing that they have sucked for decades.
Your tears are all the more bitter knowing that Marvel has become the number publisher by totally stealing DC's ideas and beating the crap out of of them in sales.
In your righteousness... you have left off a couple of rip-offs.
Lobo (Wolverine)
Aquaman (Sub-Mariner)
Batman (Zorro)
Adam Strange (Flash Gordon)
Johnny Quick (The Flash){Pretty sad when they're ripping off from inside their own company}
Teen Titans (Young Allies)
I could probably find some more.
Wow, you've got a lot of nerve bringing up Johnny Quick. Can you say Qicksilver?
Nova, I forgot Nova. And how about the doubble ripoff of StarBrand.
Ah, the New Universe. The ultimate proof, as if it were nedded, of DC's suckatude.
And if you're going to call Batman a rip-off of Zorro, then you have to call everyone who wears a mask and has a secret identity a rip-of of Zorro. Or are they all rip-offs of the Scarlet Pimpernell? (I suppose you think that name is really stupid.)
P.S. Moonknight!
You retard.
I didn't bring the rip-off thing up.
You did.
You and I both know there are no original ideas out there. If you try really hard...you can find something that was similar to it done earlier.
To use your own logic...Superman is a rip-off of Jesus.
What exactly are you using for your criteria to decide if it's a rip-off.
Masks? No one after the Scarlet Pimpernel?
Capes? No one after the Scarlet Pimpernel.
Flying? No one after Superman?
Alien? No one after Superman?
Parents die? No one after who?
If it wasn't for rip-offs you wouldn't have your precious Watchmen.
The Comedian ripped off the Peacemaker.
Dr. Manhattan ripped off Captain Atom.
Nite Owl ripped off Blue Beetle.
Ozymandias ripped off Thunderbolt.
Rorschach ripped off The Question.
Silk Spectre ripped off Nightshade.
How do you like those apples?
And don't bother telling me the history. I already know and it isn't germane to this conversation.
The upshot is...withouts 'rip-offs' (TM Dominic 2005) we wouldn't hav the greatest Super-hero story ever.
Put that in your pipe...
Regarding the Watchmen as "Rip-offs"
forgive me if I'm dealing semantics here, but is it a rip off if it's acknoledged? If i remember correctly, originally the story was going to be told with Beetle, Question, etc. and DC vetoed it 'cause those characters were being intergrated into the DCU proper by the events in Crisis - the original Crisis y'know, not the new "Buy six miniseries and go broke" tie in Crisis.
That's the history.
Whether DC said Moore couldn't do it or not is irrelevant.
It doesn't change the fact that the Watchmen are knock-offs (or rip-offs) of those Charlton guys.
As loving a rip-off it may be...it's still a rip-off.
Nice to have a new 'face' here though.
Thanks.
"To use your own logic...Superman is a rip-off of Jesus. "
Pay attention. This wasn't my logic. It was yours- when you called Batman a Zorro Rip-off. I wasn't saying everyone is a rip-off of the Scarlet Pimpernel. I was saying that's the extention of your Zorro argument.
"It doesn't change the fact that the Watchmen are knock-offs (or rip-offs) of those Charlton guys.
As loving a rip-off it may be...it's still a rip-off."
To rip-off is to steal. It's not stealing if you own the character. A knock-off is a a cheap rip-off. So, even if the Watchmen were rip-offs (which they are not) they are certainly not cheap. They are very high quality, and therefore not knock-offs.
waitaminute bill -
i still contend that a tribute or an enforced replacement is not a rip-off.
actually, taking the whole thing a step further - are there really any rip-offs - or are they Icons (no, not the black superman from that little failed if noble DC experiment, the OTHER definition of icon).
y'know - GA and Hawkeye are both cut the same cloth as Robin Hood - Like wise Batman, Moon Knight, and Blue Beetle and beyond - guy in a mask serving justice and the comman man - the Scarlet PimperZorro.
Dom, back me up a bit with this one - you've spewed fourth to me with a rant or two about Fanfics and people creating thier own damn characters, and if he had insisted on publishing them as originally concieved the story would have never seen the light of day - so given that Moore wasn't allowed to play with DC's toys as they were, what the heck is wrong with slapping a different paintjob on these iconic models and telling the damn story?
Nothing wron with it, especially when the owner tells you to do it.
OK...maybe I'm confused.
You just listed your Top Ten Marvel rip-offs...right? You did do that.
You never mentioned quality or hwo told who to do what.
If you want to be extremely kind...you can say they are 'inspirations.'
But you weren't being kind. You were being the card carrying Marvel-hater that you are.
Everyone on your list was a Marvel charcter.
No DC charcters.
No movies.
And when I turn around and list some DC examples, including the most glaring of all, all these qualifications start rolling in.
Now we're talking about quality, who told who to do what, and new rules for if the company owns the characters.
You take take part of my posts that have nothing do with anything and THAT'S what you respond to.
Who are you? John Byrne?
A rip-off is taking inspiration from a previously existing character and making one of your own.
No matter whatt the reason or the quality of the rip-off.
Aren't you the guy who told me that Superman was a 'Christ-like' figure?
Is he more Christ-like than Hawkeye is Green Arrow-like? Or less Blue Beetle-like than Nite-Owl?
I'm not mad about The Watchmen being an 'homage' to the Charlton.
I love The Watchemen.
But you can't line everything up..call black and then say...oh no not them...they're dark gray.
Quality determines if it is a KNOCK-OFF. Which is a specific kind of rip-off. A Knock-off is a cheap immitation. Watchmen is not a Knock-off. It is not cheap, shabby, hastily done, or any of the other qualities that charaterize a knock-off. You used the term Knock-off.
Rip-off means "to steal," not to take inspiration from. TO STEAL. That's what it means. Look it up. You can't steal from yourself. Therefore, the Watchmen is not a rip-off either.
I can't explain it any more simply than that.
I don't need you to put anything simply. I understand perfectly what you are saying.
But we didn't start this conversation with the dictionary version of what a rip-off was. We started it with your definition.
Hawkeye is a rip-off of Green Arrow. Completely different characters, but they both use a bow.
Fantastic Four is a rip-off of Challengers of the Unkown. One group has super-powers the other didn't. But by the new rule, a guy can't steal from himself. Kirby created both.
X-Men is a rip-off of Doom Patrol. You covered this.
Dr. Strange is a rip-off of Dr. Fate. They both use magic. But their stories are complicated and completely different. Maybe they're both rip-offs of the Wizard of Oz.
Captain America is a rip-off of the Shield. Nothing I can do about that.
Bucky and Dusty...Good God.
Avengers is a rip-off of the JLA. More an answer to, I think, but I take the point.
Mr. Fantstic is a rip-off of The Elongated Man. See Hawkere/Green Arrow response.
Man-Thing is a rip-off of the Heap. So is the Swamp-Thing.
Squadron Supreme is a rip-off of JLA. No one said they weren't. It really shouldn't be on this list, it's so blatant.
I won't get into Captain Marvel. I know why Marvel did it and do not condone. But DC had their heads up their asses.
Ka-Zar is a rip-off of Tarzan. Hmm..I can see it. But they have slightly different back-stories and settings.
A more accuraate staement would Warlord is a rip-off of Ka-Zar, but with guns.
actually, by the testiment of Stan Lee, FF is a "Rip Off" of the Justice League -
story goes (an he's told it on a couple of DVD commentaries) that he was gilfing with...some DC guy, I forget who - and the guy was taking about the great sales their new team book was having - Stan, who was considering leaving marvel at the time 'cause nobody would let him write the way he wanted to - created his own "Team Book" - and history, as they say, was made.
geeze - a zombie and a fanboy and neither of you has heard that story?
hey - didn't Charlton own Captain Marvel when Marvel created Mar-Vel?
Captain Marvel was only owned by Fawcett, and as far as I know, by DC.
Dominic may be able to shed more light on this.
But I'll check in case he doesn't.
According to toonopedia.com. Charlton owned all of the Fawcett characters when Fawcett got out of the business.
Hmm...that's interesting.
I say FF is a rip-off of Chalangers because
a) Both created of co-created by Kirby.
b) There are four of them.
c) Similar origins. A life altering crash landing.
And then there is just a general style thing. If you read the Amalgum book Chalengers of the Fantstic you can see how close they are.
Now I did say you can't steal from yourself. I don't know how to rule on a case where the artist created the character but doesn't own it. Does that count as stealing from yourself or not? It's at least recycling.
I've always heard that DC got Captain Marvel from Fawcet. I think they bought him before Fawcet went out of business and Charlton got everything. Of course DC eventually got all the Charlton stuff too. I'll see if I can find confirmation.
OK, acording to Toonopedia, when comic sales started droping, Fawcet settled the lawsuit with DC and promised never to publish Captain Marvel again. Shortly after the "sold all remaining characters to Charlton." I guess you couldn't really sell something you'd promised never to publish again. And who would want to buy it if you wouldnt' be able to publish it either. Toonopedia also describes DC as "leasing" the character when they put out their own book years later. So I guess someone associated with Fawcet still owned it.
Hmmm....Looks like rip-offs are nothing new to Marvel. Here's a lovely little snipet from toonopedia-
"Comic book publisher Martin Goodman was no respecter of the property rights of his defunct colleagues. In 1964, he appropriated the name of a superhero published in the '40s by Lev Gleason, and brought out his own version of Daredevil. A couple of years later, he introduced an outright copy of a '50s western character published by Magazine Enterprises, Ghost Rider. It wasn't until late 1967, possibly prompted by a smaller publisher's attempt to do the same, that he finally got around to stealing the name of one of the most prominent comics heroes of all time, Captain Marvel. And this delay was odd, because the name of Goodman's company was (and remains) Marvel Comics."
okay Dom, i see your point with the Challengers, but I'm not convinced your flow of logic is flawless on it -
I mean, you cite the similarities between the two team that arose from an AMALGAM comic?
The point of the series was to highlight similarities, for crying out loud!
So not only did Stan "the Man" cop to working off a good idea (a team book) but obviously DC and Marvel are both aware and don't hold a lot of grudges.
For that matter Dommy-Boy, remeber that we've played a few (okay, very few but still) RPG's, and you had an element or two in your PC's that were could be seen as lifted from other sources.
That's not an attack, man, but just trying to illustrate that there's just so many core ideas - to "steal" someone elses line, God is in the details.
I'm just saying that particular Amalgum comic was pretty easy to do. Super Soldier on the other hand was a bit of a stretch.
I'm also NOT saying I've never lifted, borrowed, been infuenced by, or stolen anything. I'm just saying that these are the top ten Marvel rip-offs.
Hell, my book The Deadalus Foundation came about because Bill said, "Why don't you do something like with Dr. Daedalus like the Fantastic Four?" But of course Dr. D. himself is a completely original character and not at all inspired by Greek mythology.
lol -
cool man - so long as you're honest about it.
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